| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| Chris Weimer |
Posted - 04/03/2006 : 22:26:56
As an outside observer, I feel free to offer my opinion on a subject where internal bickering does not make me a biased participant. If I may, I propose to change the logo from "Baptist, Protestant, and Catholic" discussion to "Catholic, Protestant, and Orthodox" discussion.
There are essentially only two reasons for doing so:
1) Baptists are a sect of the Protestant reformation. There can be no denying this from any unbiased observer. Baptist theology is a modification of Catholic theology with the major reformation issues as the principles of the church, e.g. sola fides; sola scriptura; etc.
2) In doing so, you will have taken a step in allowing the members of Orthodoxy representation, at least in name. The Orthodox churches are not an heretical branch if defined by the Nicene Creed, so there is really no reason for their exclusion. Also, they have a lot longer claim to church history than either Protestantism or Catholicism (although I do not, at this point, wish to debate which sect has the longer claim - Catholicism or Orthodoxy, but clearly it excludes Protestantism).
I think in doing so this website will greatly improve ecumenical relations across the world. Plus, I have an interest in Orthodoxy, and where else am I to go?
Chris Weimer |
| 15 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Astralis |
Posted - 04/08/2006 : 03:01:33
I think that they were permitted to keep their kings and governance exemplifies Roman control it its provinces. It's also interesting that after Herod died and Archelaus misruled that the Jews appealed to Augustus to be granted autonomy. But autonomy didn't meant the same thing then as now. They weren't seeking independence...they no longer wanted to be governed by Herodian kings but by Roman administration as part of the province of Syria. To them, a remote Gentile ruler would guarantee peace to the land that a Jewish monarch could not provide. They only got part of their wish. Judea was placed under Syrian rule as they desired, Archelaus was deposed and a Roman prefect was placed as their leader. This would have disastrous consequences, but it please most people.
Additionally, Rome's rule was not uniform. Historians believe Galilee was completely peaceful during Jesus' life. Luke explains it wasn't, but that's a different topic. I think Rome wanted peace, secure borders, and flowing tribute. As long as they had that, they left everyone to their own. On occasion there were antagonizers like Pilate and Caligula, but their actions were reversed by later rulers. |
| Chris Weimer |
Posted - 04/08/2006 : 02:23:23
What Admin said. Though they did not have total power of the area, at any time Rome technically could have grasped control. They were the zealots who provoked the Romans into pacifying the area permanently. |
| Astralis |
Posted - 04/08/2006 : 01:21:50
Well, what do you mean by conquored? Rome's involvement wasn't heavy-handed, contextually. It wasn't until the second revolt that Rome expelled Jews from Jerusalem. If that's what you mean by conquored then I would say the second Jewish revolt is when Rome asserted complete control and created a new city in Jerusalem. This is when the last Jewish monarchy existed.
Rome had "power" over the area, though, since 63BC.
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| alcovey |
Posted - 04/08/2006 : 00:46:53
I know Rome destroyed the Temple in 70 AD and others earlier, but I was interested in when Rome's power extended to the Holy Land. |
| Astralis |
Posted - 04/08/2006 : 00:17:55
Do you mean temple destructions? |
| alcovey |
Posted - 04/07/2006 : 23:52:58
At what point does Jewish and Roman history intersect? When did Rome conquer Jerusalem? |
| Chris Weimer |
Posted - 04/07/2006 : 14:24:19
Yes, the Nag Hammadi texts have been released. My broad field is historical studies, usually limited to Roman history starting with the Revolution and ending with the rise of Christianity in the 200's. Anywhere in between there is gold for me. :) |
| alcovey |
Posted - 04/07/2006 : 04:58:23
What are your favorite texts or areas of study? What do you know about the Nag Hammadi texts - have they all been releasaed? |
| Chris Weimer |
Posted - 04/06/2006 : 21:03:06
Although I am learning both Hebrew and Aramaic, it is slow coming. However, for the most part, the Talmud was written in a dialect of Hebrew usually called "Talmudic Hebrew". I think there may be some Aramaic in there, but I'm unsure. I'll try to gather more resources on the oft-neglected subject. |
| alcovey |
Posted - 04/06/2006 : 18:51:05
Hi Chris,
No, I'm not really up for an in depth study, but would like to hear a good overview from those who have. Which languages are you knowledgable of? Do you know Aramaic? |
| Chris Weimer |
Posted - 04/06/2006 : 16:32:32
Yeah, I use the one at Sacred-Texts all the time, but it's not quite the same. I really need to have a searchable Talmud put up on my site or something. So - are you interested in Talmudic and Rabbinical sstudies? |
| alcovey |
Posted - 04/05/2006 : 23:22:29
I'm not sure how many volumes there are to the Talmud in total, but I did find much of it online.
The Talmud (10 Volumes)
And here also: The Babylonian Talmud edited by Rabbi Dr. Isidore Epstein
I'm only familiar with certain portions of it and by no means have studied it in any kind of depth. The reason why it is so important is that all the major sects of Judaism hold it to be equal or perhaps more inspired than the Old Testament.
GUIDE TO TEXTS
Kabbalah
Kabbalah means 'Tradition' or 'Transmitted Teachings'. The Kabbalah is the general term for a body of Jewish mystical teachings about the mysteries of God and the universe. The teachings of the Kabbalah are based on the assumption that true knowledge can be achieved only through a certain kind of speculation.. Taken as a whole, the Kabbalah represents a world-view, providing an essentially spiritual way of seeing the world.
The Kabbalah has had a major impact upon Jewish life. Religious life, prayer, textual readings, Halachah (Jewish law), and even messianic movements have all been affected. The most important work of the Kabbalah is the Zohar, which is detailed below.
Zohar
what is it?
The Zohar (Splendour) is the central work of the Kabbalah. The Zohar is not one book, but a complete body of literature which has been united under one title. The Zohar is usually printed in five volumes. The Zohar consists of 21 parts. These parts may be printed in a variety of ways - sometimes a part might be scattered throughout other parts of the Zohar, and sometimes it might exist as a separate volume.
what is it about?
The largest part of the Zohar, which is untitled, is arranged around the sidraot (weekly Torah portions). It consists of a mystical interpretation of the Torah, mixed with statements and stories of Simeon Ben Yochai. It can be quite hard to follow due to its technical language and abrupt manner. Its points are often highly elusive and not to be grasped without close and attentive scrutiny.
The Zohar's teachings combine practically all of the main elements of the Kabbalah. The Zohar contains passages about the 10 Sefirot (Emanations) which flow from God, about the soul, and about Creation. The Zohar also deals with descriptions of heavenly places, contains symbolic interpretations of prayers and ceremonies, and explains an elaborate number and letter mysticism.
Zohar provides a world-view through the doctrine of Sefirot (Emanations). According to the Zohar, G-d is boundless, and cannot be designated by any known attributes. To allow Himself to be known at all, G-d allows 10 Sefirot to flow from Him, giving rise to the Universe. The Sefirot can be observed in the world, and allow us to 'notice' G-d. For adherents of the Kabbalah, this shapes everyday life at the most fundamental level.
where does it come from? who wrote it down?
The Zohar first appeared in Spain at around 1300 CE. It was published by Moses de Leon. Exactly where the Zohar came from is the subject of some disput, however it is commonly ascribed to Simeon Ben Yochai. Simeon Ben Yochai was one of the Tannaim (group of scholars from 400 BCE - 200 CE). He was famed for his mystical tendencies. Some maintain that Simeon Ben Yochai wrote the Zohar, others that the Zohar was merely based upon his teachings. Certainly, the Zohar as a written work was not known until it was published by Moses de Leon.
what do we do with it?
"Our masters taught: Four men entered the Pardes ('Orchard' of mystical teachings), namely Ben Azzai, Ben Zoma, Aher (Elisha Ben Abuyah), and Akiva... Ben Azzai.. died, Ben Zoma.. became demented, Aher [became a heretic]. Rabbi Akiva departed unhurt." - Babylonian Talmud, Tractate Chagigah 14b
The teachings of the Kabbalah have always been e |
| Chris Weimer |
Posted - 04/05/2006 : 18:48:07
I've tried to study the Talmud, but there are several problems, of course. One is that I'm no where near fluent enough to read Hebrew at that level, and that it's very expensive to buy the Talmud in English (actually, even more expensive to buy it in Hebrew!), and unfortunately the whole Talmud is not online. However, the Talmud is almost out of my scope of study. Mostly it would be useful in comparison of thought between older Judaism, early Christianity, and Rabbinical thought.
Have you studied the Talmud? |
| alcovey |
Posted - 04/05/2006 : 15:18:07
It is rather amazing that an atheist/agnostic would choose biblical and ancient literature as a field of study - I'm sure it gives you a unique perspective. What is really valuable is if one can clearly understand the other's perspective and not warp it - whether intentional or through ignorance. Have you ever studied the Talmud and it's role in Jewish thought? |
| Chris Weimer |
Posted - 04/05/2006 : 13:35:27
I entirely agree that some atheists are not to be listened to, being fanatical, biased, prejudiced, and other descriptive adjectives which I won't even bother going into. It's frustrating, really, especially for someone whose primary concern is ancient literature, including biblical, and all certain people can see is what they want to see. |
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