The Heretics Message to the World:Be Baptized to
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Part 2 The Heretics Message to the World:Be Baptized to be Saved!Mike and many other RCC think if you are not baptized in water you are not saved.Salvation can only come by water baptism think many religious people.Not only the RCC but the church of Jesus Christ and more... I may or may not believe coming forward is a necessary condition for salvation. But, if I clearly taught elsewhere that repentance/belief alone was sufficient no one would think coming forward is necessary for salvation,or water baptism is necessary for salvation.
Edited by evangelist on 07/19/2009 13:58:35
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And this is accomplished through water baptism, so why do you say you agree with baptism being a must and then say that it isn't?
Or do you honestly believe that devils are baptized in the blood of Christ - after all, they believe, and more strongly that you.
Pax et Bonum,
Faith_at_Large
Malachi 1:11 "For from the rising of the sun even unto the going down of the same my name [shall be] great among the Gentiles; and in every place incense [shall be] offered unto my name, and a pure offering: for my name [shall be] great among the heathen, saith the LORD of hosts."
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quote:
Originally posted by Faith_at_Large
And this is accomplished through water baptism, so why do you say you agree with baptism being a must and then say that it isn't?
Or do you honestly believe that devils are baptized in the blood of Christ - after all, they believe, and more strongly that you.
But they don't have a relationship whatsoever and they don't trust in the Lord!
Demons and satan might believe in getting wet and believe doing religious rituals, but that is ANOTHER topic.
one love
I may or may not believe coming forward is a necessary condition for salvation. But, if I clearly taught elsewhere that repentance/belief alone was sufficient no one would think coming forward is necessary for salvation,or water baptism is necessary for salvation.
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Demons do not believe in getting baptized or doing any of the rituals that Christ taught us, except to pervert them.
Either belief is sufficient or it is not. If they trusted in the Lord, they would do what He said. That is what having a relationship is.
You claim a relationship, and yet you want nothing to do with Jesus - only the gift you think He gave you. What kind of relationship with that?
The demons do as much. They do not want to obey Christ for any reason. You feel it is a nice thing to do for what He did for you, but only if it is not too much bother.
Jesus said who-so-ever believes and is baptized shall be saved, yet you chop off part of the statement by thinking that if one is not saved if they do not believe, that this rules out the necessity of baptism. If Jesus did not mean it, He would not have said it.
I trust Jesus and for that reason, I am baptized into Christ, and I trust the Church He established for my protection. In obedience to the scriptures, I obey those that God set to rule over me for they have watch over my soul.
Pax et Bonum,
Faith_at_Large
Malachi 1:11 "For from the rising of the sun even unto the going down of the same my name [shall be] great among the Gentiles; and in every place incense [shall be] offered unto my name, and a pure offering: for my name [shall be] great among the heathen, saith the LORD of hosts."
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What if those you obey FAL were wrong, them all your works and obeying them was not nothing and has no effects.
one love
I may or may not believe coming forward is a necessary condition for salvation. But, if I clearly taught elsewhere that repentance/belief alone was sufficient no one would think coming forward is necessary for salvation,or water baptism is necessary for salvation.
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PM
Member since 11/17/2007
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I have no fear of that. Jesus promised to guide His Church, and the scriptures instruct me to obey those who have rule over me.
So I am simply being obedient to God and He will not fault me for that, even if some of those men are less than perfect.
Pax et Bonum,
Faith_at_Large
Malachi 1:11 "For from the rising of the sun even unto the going down of the same my name [shall be] great among the Gentiles; and in every place incense [shall be] offered unto my name, and a pure offering: for my name [shall be] great among the heathen, saith the LORD of hosts."
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PM
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Evangelist, if you cannot trust the Bible, then what can you trust in?
The scriptures warn that there is a spirit of error and that spirit will deceive many.
Pax et Bonum,
Faith_at_Large
Malachi 1:11 "For from the rising of the sun even unto the going down of the same my name [shall be] great among the Gentiles; and in every place incense [shall be] offered unto my name, and a pure offering: for my name [shall be] great among the heathen, saith the LORD of hosts."
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PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Faith_at_Large
Evangelist, if you cannot trust the Bible, then what can you trust in?
The scriptures warn that there is a spirit of error and that spirit will deceive many.
Why you worry about the bible when your church is your final authority and not the bible??
one love
I may or may not believe coming forward is a necessary condition for salvation. But, if I clearly taught elsewhere that repentance/belief alone was sufficient no one would think coming forward is necessary for salvation,or water baptism is necessary for salvation.
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Contact:
PM
Member since 11/17/2007
Location: Canada
I am not worried for myself. The Bible instructed me to trust in my Church which is the Pillar and Foundation of Truth. THe Bible instructed me to obey those who have rule over me for they have watch over my sould.
The Bible affirms that it cannot be my final authority because Christ gave HIS Authority to His Church.
However, you are the one who claims to follow the Bible alone, and yet does not follow what it says nor heed its warnings.
Pax et Bonum,
Faith_at_Large
Malachi 1:11 "For from the rising of the sun even unto the going down of the same my name [shall be] great among the Gentiles; and in every place incense [shall be] offered unto my name, and a pure offering: for my name [shall be] great among the heathen, saith the LORD of hosts."
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Contact:
PM
Member since 07/10/2003
Location: Germany
quote:
Originally posted by Faith_at_Large
I am not worried for myself. The Bible instructed me to trust in my Church which is the Pillar and Foundation of Truth. THe Bible instructed me to obey those who have rule over me for they have watch over my sould.
The Bible affirms that it cannot be my final authority because Christ gave HIS Authority to His Church.
However, you are the one who claims to follow the Bible alone, and yet does not follow what it says nor heed its warnings.
The written is more important and has priority over the oral and traditions from men!
one love
I may or may not believe coming forward is a necessary condition for salvation. But, if I clearly taught elsewhere that repentance/belief alone was sufficient no one would think coming forward is necessary for salvation,or water baptism is necessary for salvation.
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Contact:
PM
Member since 06/26/2002
really? where is that in the bible? the oral always came first evan. and if they are true traditions and not mere traditions of men than it really doesn't matter which is more important... because they are both the word of god. when a prophet came to the king and said the word of the lord came to me do you think the king said " well nathan, if it hasn't been written, it hasn't been said."?
mike
The truth does not change according to our ability to stomach it.
Flannery O'Connor
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quote:
Originally posted by mikejuli
really? where is that in the bible? the oral always came first evan. and if they are true traditions and not mere traditions of men than it really doesn't matter which is more important... because they are both the word of god. when a prophet came to the king and said the word of the lord came to me do you think the king said " well nathan, if it hasn't been written, it hasn't been said."?
mike
1Co:4:6: And these things, brethren, I have in a figure transferred to myself and to Apollos for your sakes; that ye might learn in us not to think of men above that which is written, that no one of you be puffed up for one against another.
one love
I may or may not believe coming forward is a necessary condition for salvation. But, if I clearly taught elsewhere that repentance/belief alone was sufficient no one would think coming forward is necessary for salvation,or water baptism is necessary for salvation.
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Contact:
PM
Member since 11/17/2007
Location: Canada
quote:
Originally posted by evangelist
quote:
Originally posted by Faith_at_Large
I am not worried for myself. The Bible instructed me to trust in my Church which is the Pillar and Foundation of Truth. THe Bible instructed me to obey those who have rule over me for they have watch over my sould.
The Bible affirms that it cannot be my final authority because Christ gave HIS Authority to His Church.
However, you are the one who claims to follow the Bible alone, and yet does not follow what it says nor heed its warnings.
The written is more important and has priority over the oral and traditions from men!
one love
Paul said that the Pillar and Foundation of Truth is the Church, and that we are to stand fast in the Tradition both by word of mouth and written epistle.
But you seem to take the written word of Wommack over the Bible, just because someone writes something down that does not make it Sacred Scripture. Wommack's writings are the traditions of men that we are not supposed to be following.
The Bible says that we are to obey those that have rule over us, not those who just preach what we want to hear without any lawful authority.
Pax et Bonum,
Faith_at_Large
Malachi 1:11 "For from the rising of the sun even unto the going down of the same my name [shall be] great among the Gentiles; and in every place incense [shall be] offered unto my name, and a pure offering: for my name [shall be] great among the heathen, saith the LORD of hosts."
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Contact:
PM
Member since 07/10/2003
Location: Germany
quote:
Originally posted by Faith_at_Large
quote:
Originally posted by evangelist
quote:
Originally posted by Faith_at_Large
I am not worried for myself. The Bible instructed me to trust in my Church which is the Pillar and Foundation of Truth. THe Bible instructed me to obey those who have rule over me for they have watch over my sould.
The Bible affirms that it cannot be my final authority because Christ gave HIS Authority to His Church.
However, you are the one who claims to follow the Bible alone, and yet does not follow what it says nor heed its warnings.
The written is more important and has priority over the oral and traditions from men!
one love
Paul said that the Pillar and Foundation of Truth is the Church, and that we are to stand fast in the Tradition both by word of mouth and written epistle.
But you seem to take the written word of Wommack over the Bible, just because someone writes something down that does not make it Sacred Scripture. Wommack's writings are the traditions of men that we are not supposed to be following.
The Bible says that we are to obey those that have rule over us, not those who just preach what we want to hear without any lawful authority.
Wommack didn't write this:
1Co:4:6: And these things, brethren, I have in a figure transferred to myself and to Apollos for your sakes; that ye might learn in us not to think of men above that which is written, that no one of you be puffed up for one against another.
Wommack is only my mentol, and person of good advise which I keep the good and throw away the bad, as I prove all things and my born again spirit bears record to the truths!
I will start a new thread alone on Andrew wommack and you can give your philosphy about him better there ok?
one love
I may or may not believe coming forward is a necessary condition for salvation. But, if I clearly taught elsewhere that repentance/belief alone was sufficient no one would think coming forward is necessary for salvation,or water baptism is necessary for salvation.
Edited by evangelist on 11/15/2009 14:48:54
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Contact:
PM
Member since 06/26/2002
quote:
Originally posted by evangelist
quote:
Originally posted by mikejuli
really? where is that in the bible? the oral always came first evan. and if they are true traditions and not mere traditions of men than it really doesn't matter which is more important... because they are both the word of god. when a prophet came to the king and said the word of the lord came to me do you think the king said " well nathan, if it hasn't been written, it hasn't been said."?
mike
1Co:4:6: And these things, brethren, I have in a figure transferred to myself and to Apollos for your sakes; that ye might learn in us not to think of men above that which is written, that no one of you be puffed up for one against another.
one love
yes... thanks for proving my point. not to mention that what is written is also tradition... but really pauls concern here isn't tradition otherwise he would be undermining his own authority which he also points out in his letters. his real point is that people don't get caught up on certain men. like how dispensationalists are caught up with paul.
mike
The truth does not change according to our ability to stomach it.
Flannery O'Connor
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Yes, Evangelist. And as mikejuli pointed out, that very passage is the proof of what I am saying. The Bible says not to put men above what is written, and there you put Andrew Wommack above the written Word. He has no authority. The Bible says that we are to OBEY those that have rule over us, but Wommack does not have lawful authority. Only the Bishops lawfully ordained have this authority.
Paul stated clearly that the Church is the Pillar and Foundation of Truth. It is through the Church, that we have a canon of scripture. God inspired it, but we would know nothing of it, if God had inspired men to write the scriptures and ensured that there would be other men to preserve them and set the canon.
Pax et Bonum,
Faith_at_Large
Malachi 1:11 "For from the rising of the sun even unto the going down of the same my name [shall be] great among the Gentiles; and in every place incense [shall be] offered unto my name, and a pure offering: for my name [shall be] great among the heathen, saith the LORD of hosts."
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