what is the gospel to Catholic; the power of God?
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Accepting Jesus as your Savior with the belief that you are now going to abide by a certain set of rules, or exchange one set for another, is not the good news. Why? Because it still depends upon your performance. And I can guarantee you that the devil will make sure you more... I may or may not believe coming forward is a necessary condition for salvation. But, if I clearly taught elsewhere that repentance/belief alone was sufficient no one would think coming forward is necessary for salvation,or water baptism is necessary for salvation.
Edited by evangelist on 10/13/2009 17:09:12
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quote:
Originally posted by Thaddeus
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What does a dead Mary or a dead moses and Abraham or Paul has to do with the gospel????
I would never tell a person the Lord supper is what saves them!
First off, you sound like an atheist when you declare that Mary and Moses and Abraham and Paul are dead. The Christian position is that of the Bible, namely, Luke 20:38. And remember, the "dead" Moses and Elijah appeared to Jesus at His transfiguration centuries after they died. Dead in the body does not equate to dead in the spirit. Otherwise, how could they witness for us (Hebrews 12:1)?
Second, what could save us more than to for Christ to abide in us, and for us to abide in him (John 6:56)? As the bible says, those that are united to him are one with him (1 Corinthians 6:17)!!
Have you ever read your own bible, Evangelist?
They are in another realm of the spirit having nothing whatsoever to do with us new testimenet believers accept Christ who is risen and alive for us the one and only mediator for humans!
Christ is in us and we in Him not a moses or a mary is in us or we in a mary or abraham!
one love
I may or may not believe coming forward is a necessary condition for salvation. But, if I clearly taught elsewhere that repentance/belief alone was sufficient no one would think coming forward is necessary for salvation,or water baptism is necessary for salvation.
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quote:
Originally posted by Faith_at_Large
It does beg the question as to whether you have read the Bible, Evangelist. Paul preaches the same communion that Catholcs practice today. Jesus Christ set it up that way. You would have to abandon the Bible completely to come up with anything else.
Paul preach the good news of Christ death burial and resurrection, read you bible not a CC from religious men or a trent, and a vatican philosophy!
one love
I may or may not believe coming forward is a necessary condition for salvation. But, if I clearly taught elsewhere that repentance/belief alone was sufficient no one would think coming forward is necessary for salvation,or water baptism is necessary for salvation.
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christ has died christ has risen christ will come again?
The truth does not change according to our ability to stomach it.
Flannery O'Connor
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it is interesting how often evan says to read your bible without "religion or vatican or men etc",,, yet as i see it he's the one who keeps bringing up womack, or credflo or pasting websites to explain the bible.... i mean apart from the obvious issue that he expects us to deny one authority so he can insert his religious view, and philosophy in it's place, it just seems to me that most of the catholics here became catholic by reading the bible and finding that the "vatican" was more biblical than womack or credflo and especially c. moore.... what are we to say when the bible itself testifies to the ancient church? are we to reject the bible because you don't understand the christian church or are just seeking your own church and power? that has always been an issue for me.... evangelists often tell you that you don't need the church or men but only the bible, but then you read the bible and come to different conclusions from the evangelists and they are right there just like the church telling you what to believe, how to believe or where you can find the door..... what that means is that the evangelical witness, any evangelical witness that makes the claim that all you need is the bible is lying to you.
The truth does not change according to our ability to stomach it.
Flannery O'Connor
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quote:
Originally posted by mikejuli
christ has died christ has risen christ will come again?
Amen to that Mike, which is included down the line in the too good gospel of Christ but where we are now is even a greater relationship , and the things we already have now, that is awesome!
one love
I may or may not believe coming forward is a necessary condition for salvation. But, if I clearly taught elsewhere that repentance/belief alone was sufficient no one would think coming forward is necessary for salvation,or water baptism is necessary for salvation.
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it's nice to see you agree with the gospel evan... there is hope for you yet.. hee hee. but i have to say that there really is not such a thing as a too good gospel... or if there is there are a lot of them.. i mean the mormon gospel that we get to be gods is also a too good gospel.... for me there is only the gospel of truth... it's not a matter of too good or too bad it just simply is.... and that is what we need to deal with... making the gospel too good is only adding to christs finished work on the cross.
The truth does not change according to our ability to stomach it.
Flannery O'Connor
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PM
Member since 07/10/2003
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quote:
Originally posted by mikejuli
it's nice to see you
the mormon gospel that we get to be gods is also a too good gospel.... for me there is only the gospel of truth... it's not a matter of too good or too bad it just simply is.... and that is what we need to deal with... making the gospel too good is only adding to christs finished work on the cross.
There really no room for anything else we need and even want, because we already have the too good gospel, nothing missing and nothing broken!
one love
I may or may not believe coming forward is a necessary condition for salvation. But, if I clearly taught elsewhere that repentance/belief alone was sufficient no one would think coming forward is necessary for salvation,or water baptism is necessary for salvation.
Edited by evangelist on 10/22/2009 07:10:07
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exactly so stop adding to it.
The truth does not change according to our ability to stomach it.
Flannery O'Connor
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Originally posted by mikejuli
exactly so stop adding to it.
That is the too good gospel is that it is a knowing who we are in Christ, not a adding or taking away Mike.
The churchy AT Large teach differently and it is an adding of what we have to do or don't do, that is were the bad news and legalism and mulipulation of laws slap a christian in the face along with condemnation from religion and religous people.
If that is what your church teaches it is a strange gospel and not the gospel paul taught which was too good and what the ACt church was in one accord in.
one love
I may or may not believe coming forward is a necessary condition for salvation. But, if I clearly taught elsewhere that repentance/belief alone was sufficient no one would think coming forward is necessary for salvation,or water baptism is necessary for salvation.
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PM
Member since 06/26/2002
no the church teaches the same gospel passed on from the apostles... you don't like that one so your trying to spice it up... apparently you don't think jesus really is enough or that it was finished. if jesus said to be baptized then that's what the church says... whether you reject it or not... we cannot because we can't just manipulate the gospel of christ like you.
The truth does not change according to our ability to stomach it.
Flannery O'Connor
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Contact:
PM
Member since 07/10/2003
Location: Germany
quote:
Originally posted by mikejuli
no the church teaches the same gospel passed on from the apostles... you don't like that one so your trying to spice it up... apparently you don't think jesus really is enough or that it was finished. if jesus said to be baptized then that's what the church says... whether you reject it or not... we cannot because we can't just manipulate the gospel of christ like you.
So baptism is not a condition, and adding on a extra part we must do according to the apostles of the OT??
You are not understanding the root of grace and faith Mike and that is where your confused!
You mention baptism as <our gospel and water baptism said By Christ or the apostle is a work either way you see it or don't.
Many people around the world who embrace “Christianity” have never heard the true Gospel. They believe Christianity is nothing but a different set of rules, substituting Christian “dos and don’ts” for those of other religions. They continue to believe they must earn their way to God and then do their best to deserve the benefits of salvation. That’s not the true Gospel.
Accepting Jesus as your Savior with the belief that you are now going to abide by a certain set of rules, or exchange one set for another, is not the good news. Why? Because it still depends upon your performance. And I can guarantee you that the devil will make sure you know that your performance is not quite good enough. He is the accuser of the brethren (Rev. 12:10).
one love
I may or may not believe coming forward is a necessary condition for salvation. But, if I clearly taught elsewhere that repentance/belief alone was sufficient no one would think coming forward is necessary for salvation,or water baptism is necessary for salvation.
Edited by evangelist on 10/27/2009 22:28:23
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quote:
Originally posted by mikejuli
no the church teaches the same gospel passed on from the apostles... you don't like that one so your trying to spice it up... apparently you don't think jesus really is enough or that it was finished. if jesus said to be baptized then that's what the church says... whether you reject it or not... we cannot because we can't just manipulate the gospel of christ like you.
I don't like the OT gospel of legalism and laws and regulations.
Do you know also circumcision was also another legalism performance , and requirement of the old also???
Even the SDA goes by the laws of the sabath and a requirement , but does that make them right and have an infallible doctrine and gospel also??
one love
I may or may not believe coming forward is a necessary condition for salvation. But, if I clearly taught elsewhere that repentance/belief alone was sufficient no one would think coming forward is necessary for salvation,or water baptism is necessary for salvation.
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Contact:
PM
Member since 06/26/2002
quote:
So baptism is not a condition, and adding on a extra part we must do according to the apostles of the OT??
i don't know what you are asking. jesus said to baptize. the apostles also said to be baptized. are you saying jesus and the apostles taught the old testament rules as their gospel? i don't see that at all evan. they taught the gospel which did have it's imperative commands associated with it and was not merely an "assent" style belief. (i think therefore i am)
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You are not understanding the root of grace and faith Mike and that is where your confused!
no... i think i understand grace pretty well evan. but even if grace was as meaningless as you make it, then we would have to conclude that christ also didn't understand grace as you define it because he said to be baptized and so did the apostles. instead of re attacking us bible believing christians you need to reconcile your idea of grace with the claims make by christ and the apostles in the bible. because the way i see it is that the catholics are really the bible believing christians and you the one playing with traditions of men.
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You mention baptism as <our gospel and water baptism said By Christ or the apostle is a work either way you see it or don't.
could you please show me where i made that statement? baptism is a work evan.. it's a work of christ.. not the law. maybe you never grasped that from the bible because "works" can mean just about anything to modern sects, but in the bible when paul actually talked about works, he never refered to baptism or communion.. but specifically to works of the law. if you cannot grasp that distinction then you should take some time to understand it. because your going way beyond the bible in how you define works.
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Many people around the world who embrace “Christianity” have never heard the true Gospel. They believe Christianity is nothing but a different set of rules, substituting Christian “dos and don’ts” for those of other religions. They continue to believe they must earn their way to God and then do their best to deserve the benefits of salvation. That’s not the true Gospel.
well that is as it is. evangelicals have taught them to tithe and not smoke and to not drink or dance, etc etc. or they go to hell as a backslidden christian... 
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Accepting Jesus as your Savior with the belief that you are now going to abide by a certain set of rules, or exchange one set for another, is not the good news. Why? Because it still depends upon your performance. And I can guarantee you that the devil will make sure you know that your performance is not quite good enough. He is the accuser of the brethren (Rev. 12:10).
one love
and yet evan you are only placing rules here yourself... your making a rule of not accepting rules and that is your performance. your telling people all they need is jesus and not rules, but that too is a rule, and i'll bet that your more anal about your antinomianism than we are about simply accepting the words of the bible, especially those of jesus. that is the problem with extreme concepts of grace that are antinomian... it's no different than anarchy and is self defeating... but the biggest problem is that the antinomian is often the most legalistic person out there. always trying to find problems and always accusing others of not having enough faith or not really trusting or not really understanding grace. for us we just see jesus saying to be baptized and we say o.k. knowing that he will take care of any work done by the event.
The truth does not change according to our ability to stomach it.
Flannery O'Connor
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PM
Member since 06/26/2002
quote:
I don't like the OT gospel of legalism and laws and regulations.
then you should become a catholic... we aren't ot and never have been.
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Do you know also circumcision was also another legalism performance , and requirement of the old also???
yes..and that is why we don't do that anymore. did you know that baptism was not an "ot legalism"? and that paul compares both but never accuses baptism of being a work like circumcision?
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Even the SDA goes by the laws of the sabath and a requirement , but does that make them right and have an infallible doctrine and gospel also??
one love
what do i care about the sda? they make up thier own rules like you have made up yours. and both of you reject the true church for your own pet doctrines. you might as well ask if your rejection of the sda makes you infallible.. it doesn't.
The truth does not change according to our ability to stomach it.
Flannery O'Connor
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PM
Member since 07/10/2003
Location: Germany
But the rules you are talking about is not legalism rules, it is a love process toward God which a person want to do rather than have to do.
The motive you do things is backwards and it is a merit condition work to get good brownie points from Heaven or your RCC!
The gospel is too good to reject , but religion is a battle field and a rejection sinner and depreesed legalized people don't won't-
I think Lacy is a very good example of this and this is why she doesn't want or truth a churchy and religion.
I am sorry the churches at large arfe not preaching the too good gospel, niether the pentecostal and many others.
That is why Wommack and myself have to preach this on the streets, hotels room stadiums, and tv and radio and specially in prisons and reform schools and hospital where many are sick and need good news of healing!
one love
I may or may not believe coming forward is a necessary condition for salvation. But, if I clearly taught elsewhere that repentance/belief alone was sufficient no one would think coming forward is necessary for salvation,or water baptism is necessary for salvation.
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