spirit ,soul, and body!
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I have taught on this truth and teaching so many times and I find this is not taught in many churches and would like to get others views on this important topic!I give a very good example and teaching example with curtains explaning about our born again spirits , and how more... I may or may not believe coming forward is a necessary condition for salvation. But, if I clearly taught elsewhere that repentance/belief alone was sufficient no one would think coming forward is necessary for salvation,or water baptism is necessary for salvation.
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You fail to make the necessary distinction between repentant and unrepentant Christians (who know that they have placed their will above God's will).
In addition, you fail to understand that by our free will we commit mortal sin when we provide our:
1. Full knowledge that they are committing a mortal sin.
2. Full consent of the will to commit a mortal sin.
3. Grave matter.
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quote:
Originally posted by evangelist
Hello Faith
Look what you have on your end of your posts:
quote:
Jesus, I am a sinner, forgive me. I am weak, strengthen me. Help me to be all that you want me to be, and do not let me separate myself from you.
Your statement or a statement from a sinner who claims and stand on that he is still a sinner!
That sinner is me. That quote is my own. It is a prayer of faith. And it is perfectly Biblical. All sinners should pray such a prayer until they have stopped sinning entirely and are truly perfect, not just in "spirit".
second; he or you are begging God for forgiveness, when He done that 2000 years ago, so it is a matter of recieving that forgiveness once and for all time , which states in Hebrew 10.
Hebrews 10 says that if we should sin willfully after coming to Christ there is no more sacrifice for sin apart from the Mass and that we will face a fearsome judgment. But elsewhere in the New Testament it also says that if we confess our sins, he is quick to forgive us and cleanse us of all unrighteousness. If it applies to heretics such as the Gnostics (as you claim), which were also born again Christians, then it applies to other types of sinners - why should Gnostics get all the breaks and others just go to hell? There is no more sacrifice for sin only a fearsome judgment.
third:God has already given us all the faith and power we need and strength we need according to John 1:16, so this so called pray is a dumm and doubt prayer which God can't do nothing about !
 God is the source of all faith and grace and power. When did you forget that?
In 1 Peter God says he want all to be saved so why would a person say a dumm thing to begg God to do in which He wants done more than or anyone else can ask?
Because the Bible says so. We are called to ask often, to petition without ceasing. It is our RIGHT as the children of God to pester our Father.
Again do all righteous people go direct to heaven?
No. The Bible says that ALL go before the Judgment seat first.
2 Corinthians 5:10 10 For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad.
Do all sinners go to hell??
Those that don't repent of serious sins will certainly go to Hell along with the unbelievers and those who rejected God in any other way. Those sinners who have repented of their sins will go to Heaven.
So wheich one are you FAITH from the above ?
one love
I am a repentant sinner who abides in Christ. He came to save the sinners not the righteous who were already saved.
God will not condemn me for my humility. He knows where I put my faith and hope, and it will not go unnoticed or unrewarded.
I will not trample underfoot what Jesus did for me.
Pax et Bonum,
Faith_at_Large
"There are some in the Church, who not only do not do what is good, but even persecute it, and hate in others what they neglect to do themselves. The sin of these men is not that of infirmity or ignorance, but deliberate willful sin." — Pope St. Gregory the Great (AD 540-604)
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Member since 07/10/2003
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quote:
Originally posted by Faith_at_Large
quote:
Originally posted by evangelist
Hello Faith
Look what you have on your end of your posts:
quote:
Jesus, I am a sinner, forgive me. I am weak, strengthen me. Help me to be all that you want me to be, and do not let me separate myself from you.
Your statement or a statement from a sinner who claims and stand on that he is still a sinner!
That sinner is me. That quote is my own. It is a prayer of faith. And it is perfectly Biblical. All sinners should pray such a prayer until they have stopped sinning entirely and are truly perfect, not just in "spirit".
second; he or you are begging God for forgiveness, when He done that 2000 years ago, so it is a matter of recieving that forgiveness once and for all time , which states in Hebrew 10.
Hebrews 10 says that if we should sin willfully after coming to Christ there is no more sacrifice for sin apart from the Mass and that we will face a fearsome judgment. But elsewhere in the New Testament it also says that if we confess our sins, he is quick to forgive us and cleanse us of all unrighteousness. If it applies to heretics such as the Gnostics (as you claim), which were also born again Christians, then it applies to other types of sinners - why should Gnostics get all the breaks and others just go to hell? There is no more sacrifice for sin only a fearsome judgment.
third:God has already given us all the faith and power we need and strength we need according to John 1:16, so this so called pray is a dumm and doubt prayer which God can't do nothing about !
God is the source of all faith and grace and power. When did you forget that?
In 1 Peter God says he want all to be saved so why would a person say a dumm thing to begg God to do in which He wants done more than or anyone else can ask?
Because the Bible says so. We are called to ask often, to petition without ceasing. It is our RIGHT as the children of God to pester our Father.
Again do all righteous people go direct to heaven?
No. The Bible says that ALL go before the Judgment seat first.
2 Corinthians 5:10 10 For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad.
Do all sinners go to hell??
Those that don't repent of serious sins will certainly go to Hell along with the unbelievers and those who rejected God in any other way. Those sinners who have repented of their sins will go to Heaven.
So wheich one are you FAITH from the above ?
one love
I am a repentant sinner who abides in Christ. He came to save the sinners not the righteous who were already saved.
God will not condemn me for my humility. He knows where I put my faith and hope, and it will not go unnoticed or unrewarded.
I will not trample underfoot what Jesus did for me.
Then why you chose to remain a sinner and nristian like me and other born again christians who have nothing in thier name a sinner??
one love
I may or may not believe coming forward is a necessary condition for salvation. But, if I clearly taught elsewhere that repentance/belief alone was sufficient no one would think coming forward is necessary for salvation,or water baptism is necessary for salvation.
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PM
Member since 01/25/2012
Location: USA
Evangelist,
I sin, I acknowledge it through the advocacy of the Holy Spirit, I repent, I confess and I receive His absolution through His Church.
Christian maturity comes both through recognizing who we are in Christ and reconciling whom we are through the Holy Spirit.
Christ the King, came to save sinners.
He and the Father sent the Holy Spirit, our Advocate.
quote:
If you love me, you will keep my commandments.
And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another Advocate, to be with you forever.
This is the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees him nor knows him.
You know him, because he abides with you, and he will be in you.
I will not leave you orphaned; I am coming to you.
In a little while the world will no longer see me, but you will see me; because I live, you also will live.
On that day you will know that I am in my Father, and you in me, and I in you.
They who have my commandments and keep them are those who love me; and those who love me will be loved by my Father, and I will love them and reveal myself to them.
Christ spoke parables with unbelievers, but He explained everything with His disciples.
Mark 4:34.
Christ delegated to His Apostolic Church His authority to forgive sin or to hold it bound.
Christ would not have done that in His Church if receiving the Holy Spirit completely absolved His faithful of their past, present and future sins.
Would He?
Edited by bwellmysoul on 06/18/2012 14:27:42
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Member since 11/17/2007
Location: Canada
Evangelist, I am not choosing to remain a sinner. I am simply acknowledging that now and then, I do sin. But, I do not sin thinking that I have a free pass. I know the price that Christ paid for me, and I respect that. I don't take it for granted.
The Holy Spirit is hard at work in me. And I am very grateful for that.
Pax et Bonum,
Faith_at_Large
"There are some in the Church, who not only do not do what is good, but even persecute it, and hate in others what they neglect to do themselves. The sin of these men is not that of infirmity or ignorance, but deliberate willful sin." — Pope St. Gregory the Great (AD 540-604)
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Contact:
PM
Member since 07/10/2003
Location: Germany
quote:
Originally posted by bwellmysoul
You fail to make the necessary distinction between repentant and unrepentant Christians (who know that they have placed their will above God's will).
In addition, you fail to understand that by our free will we commit mortal sin when we provide our:
1. Full knowledge that they are committing a mortal sin.
2. Full consent of the will to commit a mortal sin.
3. Grave matter.
Do you know there is a difference to confess your sins with confession of sins to repentance of forgiveness of those sins??
Most churchy and religion use repentance or confession of sins in a way of trying to get God to wash those sins away again through another sacrifice and that is not possible, because Jesus only died once for all time!
But to confess your sins is to make knowledge of that sin to show you are sorry of that sin and to shut the door of satan condenation towards you, and guilt, stress and depression leading to death and sepration sooner or latter, because your relationship will sooner or latter grow cold against God and you hide from God , and you might run from God, like Adam and Eve did , even though God still had a relationship with them.
God didn't hide , not even because of the murder of Cain, God still had fellowship with Cain and even protected him in his curse and sin!
That is why God is such a awesome merciful God full of grace and love!
religion and churchy has turn the will of God backwards and is saying we must begg and plead for mercy of forgiveness of any future sins we do after been born again aqnd had already confessed allour sin and brought them under the eternal on going blood of forgiveness toward us christians wheich made us eternally redeemed and eternally righteous unconditional!
The blood of Jesus does not lose it eternal effect when the next time a person born again sins!
If that was true then you might need a mass, or some new sacrifice of your own or some brain washed false system of error to think you can get something else like a purgatory to get you clean again and again, or a OSAS doctrine and etc!
religion and false doctrine of religion will try anyway possible to decieve people even with bible scriptures and bible principles given interpretation of twisted truth which is basically lies fron the pits of hell!
Satan hate the blood of Jesus to the core because it is eternal and it alone keeps us righteous unless we renounce it or reject it like Islam and Mormons does, and many other pagan religions!
If a real christian knew how poerful the blood of Jesus alone really is, sins will never be an issue, past , present or any future sins!
one love
I may or may not believe coming forward is a necessary condition for salvation. But, if I clearly taught elsewhere that repentance/belief alone was sufficient no one would think coming forward is necessary for salvation,or water baptism is necessary for salvation.
Edited by evangelist on 06/19/2012 02:30:06
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PM
Member since 07/10/2003
Location: Germany
quote:
Originally posted by bwellmysoul
Evangelist,
I sin, I acknowledge it through the advocacy of the Holy Spirit, I repent, I confess and I receive His absolution through His Church.
Christian maturity comes both through recognizing who we are in Christ and reconciling whom we are through the Holy Spirit.
Christ the King, came to save sinners.
He and the Father sent the Holy Spirit, our Advocate.
quote:
If you love me, you will keep my commandments.
And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another Advocate, to be with you forever.
This is the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees him nor knows him.
You know him, because he abides with you, and he will be in you.
I will not leave you orphaned; I am coming to you.
In a little while the world will no longer see me, but you will see me; because I live, you also will live.
On that day you will know that I am in my Father, and you in me, and I in you.
They who have my commandments and keep them are those who love me; and those who love me will be loved by my Father, and I will love them and reveal myself to them.
Christ spoke parables with unbelievers, but He explained everything with His disciples.
Mark 4:34.
Christ delegated to His Apostolic Church His authority to forgive sin or to hold it bound.
Christ would not have done that in His Church if receiving the Holy Spirit completely absolved His faithful of their past, present and future sins.
Would He?
That is you are confussed!
Please don't mix the Holy Spirit with Jesus Blood they are different systems and different purposes!
the Holy Spirit is our comforter not our acusser or condemn us!
the Blood of Jesus is the thing which washed all our sins away past , present and all future sins because the blood of Jesus is an forever or eternal promise toward us-
It is like God promised never again to flood the world and that promise up today is with the sign of a rainbow, the better word or sign as such we have is the blood of Jesus with is the cross where He shed His blood and death for us eternalty redemption paid in full the finished work of the cross for us, because of His blood.
That is why Jesus said preach that gospel to all nations in Mathew Hid death burial and resurrection, which all come down to His blood shed sacrifice , because all sins had to be justly dealt with for all time which is clearly mention in Hebrews specially chapter 10, for all time, which is the biblical proof and Faith promise that all our future sins are already forgiven and forgotten sense God does not live in time and space praise the Lord!
Religion and men might see this differently , but how can they see when they are blind and live by the darkness of men theology and philosophy of blinded men?
That is why the bible warns not to cast the pearls to swines!
one love
I may or may not believe coming forward is a necessary condition for salvation. But, if I clearly taught elsewhere that repentance/belief alone was sufficient no one would think coming forward is necessary for salvation,or water baptism is necessary for salvation.
Edited by evangelist on 06/19/2012 02:47:31
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quote:
Originally posted by Faith_at_Large
Evangelist, I am not choosing to remain a sinner. I am simply acknowledging that now and then, I do sin. But, I do not sin thinking that I have a free pass. I know the price that Christ paid for me, and I respect that. I don't take it for granted.
The Holy Spirit is hard at work in me. And I am very grateful for that.
Sister FAith
You are not alone , I also still sins, even maybe even more than you and other Christian in many ways, but no way will I call my self a sinner!
even though my kids do lie, and foolish things i would not call them liars, or stupid foolish dumm kids, that is putting a curse on my own kids and a parent who would say such thing, i would question thier love toward thier own kids.
I would attack the situation as being foolish or that spirit behind them, but never attack them in cursing them with the powers of my Tongue, because death and life is in the power of our tongues!
I have learned how to bless my kids and show more love and mercy that they respond more in obedience out of love back because of my good word towards them, and they are really sorry not out of fear but out od respect and the too good love toward them they change for the better, than in rebellion out of punishment and fear!
Love hide a multitude of sins FAITH!
If you are not choosen to remain a sinner , then get born again , saved now ASAP and come and join the body of Christ and get in His Kingdom and because the righteousness sister of God!
I hope next time I here you say when you make this choice , Hey evangelist..... I was sinner and now I AM THE RIGHTEOUSNESS OF GOD!
I would be so pround of you to see you speak truth over your life after getting born again and say I am sister Rightious FAITH a bloved Child of God!WWWWOOOW! AMEN!
I would say to you Shalom Righteous FAITH!
I may or may not believe coming forward is a necessary condition for salvation. But, if I clearly taught elsewhere that repentance/belief alone was sufficient no one would think coming forward is necessary for salvation,or water baptism is necessary for salvation.
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PM
Member since 11/17/2007
Location: Canada
I am already born again. There is no need to repeat this.
I am already in Christ, In His Body, and in His Kingdom.
I am not calling my children sinners or liars or anything else. I am acknowledging that I sin - the Bible says this is a good thing.
I don't go around calling myself a sinner in general. I don't live my life seeking to be a sinner or to remain a sinner. You are merely getting caught up in terminology. In the the Bible when they call someone a sinner, they are referring to someone who has not repented of their sins. And this is true even of born again Christians.
One of the greatest tragedies in the Bible is when a born again Christian sins but then does not repent of that sin. They are lost. Paul said so. Peter said that for them, it would have been better if they had never been born again.
Pax et Bonum,
Faith_at_Large
"There are some in the Church, who not only do not do what is good, but even persecute it, and hate in others what they neglect to do themselves. The sin of these men is not that of infirmity or ignorance, but deliberate willful sin." — Pope St. Gregory the Great (AD 540-604)
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Member since 11/17/2007
Location: Canada
Now how about getting back on track. You keep saying that there is more than one Christian baptism that we should be getting.
Show me from the scriptures where it says that anyone was baptized more than once with Christian baptisms, or where anyone who was baptized is told they still have one or two more to go.
Pax et Bonum,
Faith_at_Large
"There are some in the Church, who not only do not do what is good, but even persecute it, and hate in others what they neglect to do themselves. The sin of these men is not that of infirmity or ignorance, but deliberate willful sin." — Pope St. Gregory the Great (AD 540-604)
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Contact:
PM
Member since 01/25/2012
Location: USA
quote:
Originally posted by evangelist
Do you know there is a difference to confess your sins with confession of sins to repentance of forgiveness of those sins??
Most churchy and religion use repentance or confession of sins in a way of trying to get God to wash those sins away again through another sacrifice and that is not possible, because Jesus only died once for all time!
But to confess your sins is to make knowledge of that sin to show you are sorry of that sin and to shut the door of satan condenation towards you, and guilt, stress and depression leading to death and sepration sooner or latter, because your relationship will sooner or latter grow cold against God and you hide from God , and you might run from God, like Adam and Eve did , even though God still had a relationship with them.
God didn't hide , not even because of the murder of Cain, God still had fellowship with Cain and even protected him in his curse and sin!
That is why God is such a awesome merciful God full of grace and love!
religion and churchy has turn the will of God backwards and is saying we must begg and plead for mercy of forgiveness of any future sins we do after been born again aqnd had already confessed allour sin and brought them under the eternal on going blood of forgiveness toward us christians wheich made us eternally redeemed and eternally righteous unconditional!
The blood of Jesus does not lose it eternal effect when the next time a person born again sins!
If that was true then you might need a mass, or some new sacrifice of your own or some brain washed false system of error to think you can get something else like a purgatory to get you clean again and again, or a OSAS doctrine and etc!
religion and false doctrine of religion will try anyway possible to decieve people even with bible scriptures and bible principles given interpretation of twisted truth which is basically lies fron the pits of hell!
Satan hate the blood of Jesus to the core because it is eternal and it alone keeps us righteous unless we renounce it or reject it like Islam and Mormons does, and many other pagan religions!
If a real christian knew how poerful the blood of Jesus alone really is, sins will never be an issue, past , present or any future sins!
one love
Luther's Reformation is why you believe what you believe about Reconciliation.
You read the Bible, yet you refuse to acknowledge that Christ gave His authority to forgive sins to His Apostles upon His Resurrection.
He establish His Church and He ordained His priests and they were given the authority to forgive or hold sins bound.
Jesus would not have instituted that system of forgiveness had He intended in "one fell swoop" to forgive all humanity of all their sins - past, present and future.
Your interpretation of Scripture is simply - illogical.
You have no answer for what Christ established in the Upper Room. When He spoke to His Apostles and said, "As the Father has sent Me, so I send you." "Whose sins you forgive, they are forgiven. Whose sins you hold bound, they are held bound."
Jesus died "once for all" to end animal sacrifice, and to establish salvation through Him. At the end of time He said there will be "sheep" and there will be "goats". He said He would "spit out" the lukewarm Christians due to their actions and inactions.
Christ did not die to excuse Christians of their unrepentant sins.
Your idea of what Catholics believe and what Catholicism is - is brainwash.
The Holy Spirit - to quote a phrase - 'comforts the afflicted and afflicts the comfortable'.
Christ saves the repentant of their confessed sins. And, he said in order to do that, that adults need to come to His Kingdom with humility, as little children.
quote:
[b}we must begg and plead for mercy of forgiveness of any future sins [/b]
What are you talking about? We confess the sins which we have commited.
Reconciliation of the soul with Christ is necessary prior to receiving Him in the Eucharist.
In that you don't believe in the Presence of Christ in the Eucharist, (which the Early Church did) I can understand your exaggerated hope (past, present, future about the forgiveness of sin).
Christ didn't teach that (your past, present, future theory) St. Paul didn't teach that, none of the Apostles taught that. And the Early Church didn't believe in that either.
You continue to call people who practice the Commandments "churchy".
Christ established One Church and we honor Him at His Church on the day of His Resurrection. God sent His Son for the forgiveness of sin. To save the repentent.
Luke 15:7
Christ Jesus said,
quote:
Just so, I tell you, there will be more joy in heaven over one sinner who repents than over ninety-nine righteous persons who need no repentance.
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quote:
Originally posted by Faith_at_Large
I am already born again. There is no need to repeat this.
I am already in Christ, In His Body, and in His Kingdom.
I am not calling my children sinners or liars or anything else. I am acknowledging that I sin - the Bible says this is a good thing.
I don't go around calling myself a sinner in general. I don't live my life seeking to be a sinner or to remain a sinner. You are merely getting caught up in terminology. In the the Bible when they call someone a sinner, they are referring to someone who has not repented of their sins. And this is true even of born again Christians.
One of the greatest tragedies in the Bible is when a born again Christian sins but then does not repent of that sin. They are lost. Paul said so. Peter said that for them, it would have been better if they had never been born again.
But they don't label themselves a sinners like you do!
We all come short of the glory and sin, but that is no more our nature if you are born again, because if you are born again , you got a pure non sinful nature when you accept Christ in your heart spiritually!
Again there can't be any label or title mention to a bornb again christian as being a sinner, because that sinner died and that is all taught in Romans 6 and that old sinner you were was buried gone, in the grave yard as such!
To say you still sin that is a true fact, but that is not what you are!
I was a old black panther member of a racist black group , but sense I am born again I would never say I still am a black panther member saved by grace, that would make me still an active panther member who trys to kill white people, which would mean i must kill my own white Germany wife as a faithful active member and hate her on top of all thet!
Do you see how dangerious and a slap in Jesus face to still call yourself a sinner?
one love
I may or may not believe coming forward is a necessary condition for salvation. But, if I clearly taught elsewhere that repentance/belief alone was sufficient no one would think coming forward is necessary for salvation,or water baptism is necessary for salvation.
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PM
Member since 01/25/2012
Location: USA
Evangelist,
Why is it so difficult for you to embrace God's Commandments?
You should not be preaching that Christians remain justified and saved when they refuse to follow God's Commandments.
It's one thing for some; to be faithful Christians who fail in controlling certain habitual sins.
It's quite another for the unfaithful Christian who enjoys wallering in sin.
There are multiple and various reasons for why people choose their will over God's will for them.
Christ instituted the Sacrament of Reconciliation with His Apostles.
You reject what He established. In place of what He created you establsih your own theory and system.
You make it simple for you to understand and comply. You grant forgiveness for all past, present and future sins.
Your way...is not God's way. He didn't establish what you preach.
Plan and simple.
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Contact:
PM
Member since 07/10/2003
Location: Germany
quote:
Originally posted by bwellmysoul
Evangelist,
Why is it so difficult for you to embrace God's Commandments?
You should not be preaching that Christians remain justified and saved when they refuse to follow God's Commandments.
It's one thing for some; to be faithful Christians who fail in controlling certain habitual sins.
It's quite another for the unfaithful Christian who enjoys wallering in sin.
There are multiple and various reasons for why people choose their will over God's will for them.
Christ instituted the Sacrament of Reconciliation with His Apostles.
You reject what He established. In place of what He created you establsih your own theory and system.
You make it simple for you to understand and comply. You grant forgiveness for all past, present and future sins.
Your way...is not God's way. He didn't establish what you preach.
Plan and simple.
Then you don't believe in the finished work of the cross?
How long does Jesus blood takes effect on a believer?
Have you heard of an momentary redemption?
please explain what that mean if you do!
one love
I may or may not believe coming forward is a necessary condition for salvation. But, if I clearly taught elsewhere that repentance/belief alone was sufficient no one would think coming forward is necessary for salvation,or water baptism is necessary for salvation.
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Member since 01/25/2012
Location: USA
I believe what the Apostles taught His Church about the "finished work of the cross."
And, I believe that Christ's work and the work of the Holy Spirit is ongoing in every one of us.
Christ's Body and His Blood are available to all of us, but only a few choose to find life through Him - there.
I have heard what the protestantisms call "momentary redemption". But, I don't listen to protestants, I listen to Christ and to His Church.
I believe that God respects human free will. We choose communion with Christ, or we don't. And St. Paul told us to discern the Body prior to eating the bread; he said we can draw down condemnation upon ourselves.
"There is life and there is death. Choose life."
Christ said to St. John:
quote:
"Those whom I love, I reprove and discipline, so be zealous and repent.
I came that they may have life and have it abundantly. ... If anyone hears My voice and opens the door, I will come in to him and eat with him, and he with Me.
The one who conquers, I will grant him to sit with me on my throne, as I also conquered and sat down with my Father on his throne. 22
He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches.’”(Rev 3:19-22)
quote:
"Those whom I love, I reprove and discipline, so be zealous and repent. The one who conquers I will grant....
Do Christ's words match your interpretation of His finished work on the cross? That His "once for all" sacrifice removed "past, present and future" sin?
I think not.
And clearly here; Christ in Revelation, is not as you say, "speaking to those in the Old Testament".
quote:
He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches.
Edited by bwellmysoul on 06/19/2012 11:20:36
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