Andrew wommack exposing the errors in churchy!
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First Member
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Member since 07/10/2003
Location: Germany
This teaching covers everything you need to know about the gospel and why there is so many anti gospel churchs and anti gospel christians and religious people! http://www.awmi.net/extra/audio/righteousnessPlease listen to this and give your commits on this awesome teaching which has changed thousands of people and churches and many ministers and pastor life to the truth of God will and the good news of biblical gospel. I say again if you are a legalized , religious person you problemly won't like this or agree with this teaching because it is setting people free indeed and more in the love toward God because of the knowledge revealed on this righteousness series! Please listen to all the series but the main one is : God attitude towards sin! Thank you one love I may or may not believe coming forward is a necessary condition for salvation. But, if I clearly taught elsewhere that repentance/belief alone was sufficient no one would think coming forward is necessary for salvation,or water baptism is necessary for salvation.
Edited by evangelist on 12/09/2011 20:48:31
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PM
Member since 11/17/2007
Location: Canada
Andrew Wommack is a heretic. I will not listen to anything from him until he repents and returns to the True Gospel of Christ.
Pax et Bonum,
Faith_at_Large
"There are some in the Church, who not only do not do what is good, but even persecute it, and hate in others what they neglect to do themselves. The sin of these men is not that of infirmity or ignorance, but deliberate willful sin." — Pope St. Gregory the Great (AD 540-604)
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Fifth Member
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PM
Member since 10/13/2007
Location: USA
I take offense to that statement. I am not legalized, but I am free, indeed.
"Be good, keep your feet dry, your eyes open, your heart at peace and your soul in the joy of Christ." - Thomas Merton
www.percalamus.com
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Member since 06/26/2002
evan.. i already have a relationship with christ.. i don't need andrew womacks religion forced on me. not to mention that cults like mormons and jw and christian science also use the same arguments and loops for their churchys. so why on earth would i want to go to womacks churchy just to be a part of his religious society?
http://falseteachersexposed.blogspot.com/2006/04/andrew-wommack.html
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PM
Member since 07/10/2003
Location: Germany
quote:
Originally posted by mikejuli
evan.. i already have a relationship with christ.. i don't need andrew womacks religion forced on me. not to mention that cults like mormons and jw and christian science also use the same arguments and loops for their churchys. so why on earth would i want to go to womacks churchy just to be a part of his religious society?
http://falseteachersexposed.blogspot.com/2006/04/andrew-wommack.html
I guess you won't let the bible get in the way of your society and your philosophy , so There no hope even when the Holy Spirit is warning you, you would reject Him as well!
SAD
one love
I may or may not believe coming forward is a necessary condition for salvation. But, if I clearly taught elsewhere that repentance/belief alone was sufficient no one would think coming forward is necessary for salvation,or water baptism is necessary for salvation.
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PM
Member since 11/17/2007
Location: Canada
Well, Wommack didn't let the Bible get in the way of his society and philosophy.
Pax et Bonum,
Faith_at_Large
"There are some in the Church, who not only do not do what is good, but even persecute it, and hate in others what they neglect to do themselves. The sin of these men is not that of infirmity or ignorance, but deliberate willful sin." — Pope St. Gregory the Great (AD 540-604)
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Fourth Member
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PM
Member since 01/17/2007
Location: USA
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Member since 11/17/2007
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I like this:
Romans 2:25-26 25For circumcision verily profiteth, if thou keep the law: but if thou be a breaker of the law, thy circumcision is made uncircumcision.
26Therefore if the uncircumcision keep the righteousness of the law, shall not his uncircumcision be counted for circumcision?
I wanted to find out what Andrew Wommack had to say and it was enlightening.
From this Bible commentary section, which oddly enough only goes up to 2nd Timothy.
quote:
Note 4 at Ro 2:26: Notice that Paul did not say that the uncircumcision kept the Law. Instead he mentioned them keeping the "righteousness" of the Law (this verse) and "fulfilling" the Law (Ro 2:27)--there is a difference. A person can fulfill the righteousness of the Law through faith in Jesus, but no one, Jew or Gentile, can keep the Law.
Clever. How to circumvent the Law by playing with words.
But what exactly was meant? Well, no one under the New Covenant is expected to keep the Mosaic Law, but God's Commandments, that is a whole other kettle of fish.
And are they doing something or just being righteous because Jesus is righteous?
According to Paul, they are DOING what is right rather than just accepting legal righteousness.
Romans 2:14-16 14For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:
15Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another;)
16In the day when God shall judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ according to my gospel.
Wommack's explantion for verse 14 is this:
quote:
Note 8 at Ro 2:14: This is speaking of the intuitive knowledge of God described in Ro 1 (see note 2 at Ro 1:18).
And in case anyone was wondering what is in the aforementioned note 2?
quote:
Note 2 at Ro 1:18: In Ro 1:18-20, Paul was declaring that God has revealed Himself to all mankind. Old Testament scriptures proclaim that God has revealed Himself to everyone through nature (Ps 19:1-3), but Paul was stating here that there is an intuitive revelation of God within every person.
There are five words used in these three verses to describe the extent to which God has revealed Himself to mankind, and they are worth special note. Any one of these five words used by itself would have made a strong argument for Paul's case. However, the combination of these words in just two sentences emphasizes the certainty of Paul's claims.
The use of the word "all" in Ro 1:18 shows the extent to which God has revealed Himself. God has placed a witness within every person against all ungodliness and unrighteousness.
In Ro 1:19, the Greek word that was translated "manifest" is the Greek word "PHANEROS," and it means "shining, i.e. apparent" (Strong's Concordance). The Greek word translated "shewed" in this verse is "PHANEROO," which is derived from PHANEROS. PHANEROO means "to render apparent (literally or figuratively)" (Strong's Concordance). These words make it very clear that this instinctive or intuitive knowledge is not so subtle that it can be overlooked. God gives every individual the right to choose, but there can be no doubt that every person has, at one time, clearly seen and understood (Ro 1:20) the basic truths of God's existence.
In Ro 1:20, Paul said this inner witness of God causes the individual to clearly see the invisible things of God and even understand the Godhead. The Greek word that was translated "clearly seen" is the word "KATHORAO," and it means "to behold fully, i.e. (figuratively) distinctly apprehend" (Strong's Concordance). This leaves no doubt that every person who has ever walked the earth has had a clear revelation of God. The use of the word "understood" emphatically states that God gave man not only knowledge but also the understanding to use that knowledge.
Therefore, no one will be able to stand before God on the Day of Judgment and say, "God is not fair." He has given all people who have ever lived, regardless of how remote or isolated they may have been, the opportunity to know Him. They are without excuse.
Someone might say, "If all this is true, then why can't we observe more of this intuitive knowledge of God in the lives of those who have not heard the Gospel?" Paul gave the answer to this in Ro 1:21-23 (see note 1 at Ro 1:21).
An awful lot of words to say something very simple.
Romans 2:15 15Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another;)
God wrote His Laws upon our hearts.
Hebrews 8:10 10For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:
Hebrews 10:16 16This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, saith the Lord, I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them;
This comes from a prophecy from the OT:
Jeremiah 31:33 33But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.
Now I am not sure why all that massive explanation to deal with Romans 1:18.
18For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness;
19Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.
I added verse 19 for context.
God's Laws are written upon our hearts, so there is no excuse for not living by them. And this does not become obsolete when we come to Christ.
Pax et Bonum,
Faith_at_Large
"There are some in the Church, who not only do not do what is good, but even persecute it, and hate in others what they neglect to do themselves. The sin of these men is not that of infirmity or ignorance, but deliberate willful sin." — Pope St. Gregory the Great (AD 540-604)
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PM
Member since 11/17/2007
Location: Canada
The most entertaining is Romans 6:3.
quote:
Note 4 at Ro 6:3: Our spirits are the part of us that became born again (see note 2 at Joh 3:3), and this is the part of us that Paul was referring to as being baptized into Jesus and His death (see note 3 at Mt 26:41). Our physical bodies are not dead, and our souls are not dead. But our "old man" died with Christ (see note 8 at Ro 6:6).
Commentaries can be very good if they provide insight into the verse or passage, but Wommack literally re-imagines the verse to mean something completely different from what was written.
Paul does not say that only our spirits are born again. But at least Wommack does associate baptism with being born again, but unfortunately he bungles it again in his next note, also lengthy, which goes on to explain why he thinks that the baptism referred to in Romans 6:3 is not water baptism base in part on Hebrews 6:2, when the author speaks of the doctrine of baptisms, plural, as if this meant that there was more than one Christian baptism.
Apparently he overlooked Ephesians 4:5 where Paul explicitly states that there is only one baptism as far as Christians are concerned. Wommack has an explanation for this too, being that there is only one saving baptism that baptizes us into Christ but does not include water.
He does not have a commentary on Peter, which is too bad, because I would love to see his work-around for Peter's statement that water baptism does save us.
What is with all dead works that many believe in? Why does anyone think that God would give us dead works to perform for no particular reason than perhaps as a sign for men? Why would God care what men think or that we should do anything to impress men?
The water is for our benefit, a tangible sign for something intangible, but water baptism is not a dead work, but something so much more. An outward sign of an inward grace.
Hebrews does say "baptisms" plural, but remember at the time, there were several baptisms, but only one Christian baptism.
The Hebrews who had not converted to Christ did have baptism for purification - this did not save. John the Baptist gave the Baptism of Repentance, but this did not save either, it was preparation for the New Covenant. Both types of baptism involved water. The third type of baptism also involved water but also the Spirit. Christian baptism is not Hebrew baptism and is also not John the Baptist's baptism.
To suggest that Christians have multiple baptisms to go through is silly and unsupported by the Bible.
Ephesians 4:5 says that there is ONE BAPTISM, not one baptism for salvation plus other baptisms to show men that we got wet.
Pax et Bonum,
Faith_at_Large
"There are some in the Church, who not only do not do what is good, but even persecute it, and hate in others what they neglect to do themselves. The sin of these men is not that of infirmity or ignorance, but deliberate willful sin." — Pope St. Gregory the Great (AD 540-604)
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Fourth Member
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PM
Member since 01/17/2007
Location: USA
It's rather amusing that some of Evan's favorite anti-Catholic websites (like Jesus-is-Savior.com) also call Wommack a heretic. They even accuse him of preaching a works salvation.
Hey,... but they are all 'bible Christians' using the bible as their final authority right?
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Fourth Member
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Member since 01/17/2007
Location: USA
I've often wondered what evangelicals see as the purpose of the law written on our hearts and the indwelling of the holy spirit and from Ezekiels prophecy "I will cause you to walk in my statutes". Is this simply a covering or a radical infusion?
Even with these divine gifts they say we still can't keep the commandments.
Apparently, the only thing it does (in common) is to make them bible experts.
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Member since 11/17/2007
Location: Canada
I also find it funny that God's Commandments should be considered difficult.
Matthew 19:16-20 16And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life?
17And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.
18He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness,
19Honour thy father and thy mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
20The young man saith unto him, All these things have I kept from my youth up: what lack I yet?
This fellow considered keeping the Commandments as child's play. And I agree. Keeping them OT style is child's play. I have never had any trouble at all keeping the letter of the Law.
When I call myself a sinner, it has been the spirit of the Law under the NEW Covenant that has been more challenging, but even that is not impossible.
Matthew 5 shows the difference between the OT style and the NT style of keeping the commandments. Under the OT, one had to physically have sex with someone to commit adultery. Under the NT, even to fantasize about it counted as adultery. The Spirit of the Law eliminates all the loopholes. God goes by what is in our hearts, not what some lawyer proposed as meeting the requirements.
Pax et Bonum,
Faith_at_Large
"There are some in the Church, who not only do not do what is good, but even persecute it, and hate in others what they neglect to do themselves. The sin of these men is not that of infirmity or ignorance, but deliberate willful sin." — Pope St. Gregory the Great (AD 540-604)
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Contact:
PM
Member since 06/26/2002
quote:
Originally posted by evangelist
I guess you won't let the bible get in the way of your society and your philosophy , so There no hope even when the Holy Spirit is warning you, you would reject Him as well!
SAD
one love
Not sure what you mean here Evan. There is no conflict between the church and the bible like there is between Womack and the bible. And i most certainly would listen when the holy spirit warns me of something, why do you think I left you society and philosophy? I do think it's sad the lengths you take to attack and manipulate. Your desperate attempts to through out a rebuttal only prove the serious lack in your beliefs.
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PM
Member since 11/17/2007
Location: Canada
I have been reading through Wommack's commentaries and Evangelist quotes him more often than the Bible.
Pax et Bonum,
Faith_at_Large
"There are some in the Church, who not only do not do what is good, but even persecute it, and hate in others what they neglect to do themselves. The sin of these men is not that of infirmity or ignorance, but deliberate willful sin." — Pope St. Gregory the Great (AD 540-604)
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Fourth Member
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PM
Member since 01/17/2007
Location: USA
And Evan says he don't need no Pope?
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PM
Member since 06/26/2002
well is that really any surprise? for all his claims about popes and clubs and religious and churchy, it's only expected that he is harping on areas in his own life he falls short in. he cannot help but think that everyone else, especially us catholics, are as dependent and puppy eyed as he is. he fails to realise the paradoxical nature of things. he rejects leadership and authority but ends up so dependant on leaders, while we catholic understand leadership and authority but tend to be able to truly think for ourselves. maybe it's because catholics tend to be critical about their leaders in the right way while evan and others criticism is more based on rebellion.
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