who born again christian are in the spirit!

quote:

---

Originally posted by bwellmysoul

quote:

---

Originally posted by evangelist

Hello bwellmysoul

Do you live by the commandment and obey every single law, and live by it, and perfect in all of them?

If you say you don't and you are only trying your best to get God to judge you by your curves and zig zags, then you won't make it to heaven!
You better get a hold of Jesus our Saviour who was perfect and did 2000 years ago obeyed every single commandment and laws to the (T)!

one love

one love

---

The Son of God said, "Do the Commandments."

Are you saying that Jesus misspoke or that He didn't fully comprehend His own Gospel?

The Son of God said, "If you obey my commands, you will remain in my love, just as I have obeyed my Father's commands and remain in his love."

?

Might I suggest - that you attempt to stomach the sections of the Gospel where the Son of God talks directly about our sin natures.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by bwellmysoul
P.S. While the Apostles were out preaching Christ's Gospel and establishing His Church, the Jewish High Priest was continuing to offer sacrifice for the removal of his and Israel's sins on the Day of Atonement through the blood of animals, on the Temple Mount.

---

quote:

---

Parsha Summary

G-d taught Moses the general laws of sacrificial offerings.

The only three animals permitted for offerings were oxen, sheep, and goats, and from the bird species, only young doves and mature turtledoves.

In some cases one who could not afford an animal or a bird could substitute it with a flour-offering.

The Torah portion discusses the different kinds of sacrifices:

1.The elevation-offering is sacrificed to atone for an intentional sin or to raise one’s spiritual level; the entire sacrifice is consumed by the fire.

2.The flour-offering is made of flour and oil mixed with incense.

There are various types of the flour-offerings, differing in the type of pan used and whether the portion burned on the altar was removed before, or after the offering was baked. Neither honey nor leavening was permitted in any offering.

3.The peace-offering was a voluntary offering brought to express one’s love of G-d and desire to be close to Him.

Only part of it was sacrificed on the altar, and the rest was divided between the priests and the owners.

4.The sin-offering was an obligatory sacrifice brought by a Jew who inadvertently transgressed a negative mitzvah for which the punishment would be spiritual excision if done intentionally.

In addition the Torah portion mentions three special kinds of sin-offerings brought to atone for sins committed by three influential people – the Kohen Gadol (High Priest), the Sanhedrin (judges), or the king.

There are also specific sins for which the animal brought for the offering varies in accordance with the transgressor financial situation.

5.The guilt-offering was offered for five specific sins (only two are mentioned in this Torah portion).

If someone is unsure whether he committed a sin for which a sin-offering would be brought, he must bring a pending guilt-offering.

If he later ascertains that he did indeed commit the sin, he brings a sin-offering.

The pending guilt-offering atones not for the sin itself but for the carelessness which allowed it.

A person who steals an object must return it plus one-fifth of its value, and he must bring a guilt-offering.

The intended effect of an offering was to arouse a sinner to repentance, thus each part of the procedure was to atone for some aspect of the sin.

1.The sinner placed his hand of the animal’s head – to atone for his deeds.

2.The sinner verbally confessed – to atone for his sinful speech.

3.The innards were burnt – to atone for wayward thoughts.

4.The blood was sprinkled – symbolizing the sinner’s blood that should have been shed.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by evangelist

quote:

---

Originally posted by bwellmysoul

quote:

---

Originally posted by evangelist

Hello bwellmysoul

Do you live by the commandment and obey every single law, and live by it, and perfect in all of them?

If you say you don't and you are only trying your best to get God to judge you by your curves and zig zags, then you won't make it to heaven!
You better get a hold of Jesus our Saviour who was perfect and did 2000 years ago obeyed every single commandment and laws to the (T)!

one love

one love

---

The Son of God said, "Do the Commandments."

Are you saying that Jesus misspoke or that He didn't fully comprehend His own Gospel?

The Son of God said, "If you obey my commands, you will remain in my love, just as I have obeyed my Father's commands and remain in his love."

?

Might I suggest - that you attempt to stomach the sections of the Gospel where the Son of God talks directly about our sin natures.

---

Please anwer my question and stop running around a religious bush!


Do you live by the commandment and obey every single law, and live by it, and perfect in all of them?

one love

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by bwellmysoul

quote:

---

Originally posted by bwellmysoul
P.S. While the Apostles were out preaching Christ's Gospel and establishing His Church, the Jewish High Priest was continuing to offer sacrifice for the removal of his and Israel's sins on the Day of Atonement through the blood of animals, on the Temple Mount.

---

Here is a very very small example of the established "works" of the Mosaic law that Christ's Apostolic Church split away from:

quote:

---

Parsha Summary

G-d taught Moses the general laws of sacrificial offerings.

The only three animals permitted for offerings were oxen, sheep, and goats, and from the bird species, only young doves and mature turtledoves.

In some cases one who could not afford an animal or a bird could substitute it with a flour-offering.

The Torah portion discusses the different kinds of sacrifices:

1.The elevation-offering is sacrificed to atone for an intentional sin or to raise one’s spiritual level; the entire sacrifice is consumed by the fire.

2.The flour-offering is made of flour and oil mixed with incense.

There are various types of the flour-offerings, differing in the type of pan used and whether the portion burned on the altar was removed before, or after the offering was baked. Neither honey nor leavening was permitted in any offering.

3.The peace-offering was a voluntary offering brought to express one’s love of G-d and desire to be close to Him.

Only part of it was sacrificed on the altar, and the rest was divided between the priests and the owners.

4.The sin-offering was an obligatory sacrifice brought by a Jew who inadvertently transgressed a negative mitzvah for which the punishment would be spiritual excision if done intentionally.

In addition the Torah portion mentions three special kinds of sin-offerings brought to atone for sins committed by three influential people – the Kohen Gadol (High Priest), the Sanhedrin (judges), or the king.

There are also specific sins for which the animal brought for the offering varies in accordance with the transgressor financial situation.

5.The guilt-offering was offered for five specific sins (only two are mentioned in this Torah portion).

If someone is unsure whether he committed a sin for which a sin-offering would be brought, he must bring a pending guilt-offering.

If he later ascertains that he did indeed commit the sin, he brings a sin-offering.

The pending guilt-offering atones not for the sin itself but for the carelessness which allowed it.

A person who steals an object must return it plus one-fifth of its value, and he must bring a guilt-offering.

The intended effect of an offering was to arouse a sinner to repentance, thus each part of the procedure was to atone for some aspect of the sin.

1.The sinner placed his hand of the animal’s head – to atone for his deeds.

2.The sinner verbally confessed – to atone for his sinful speech.

3.The innards were burnt – to atone for wayward thoughts.

4.The blood was sprinkled – symbolizing the sinner’s blood that should have been shed.

---

Far more information on the Mosaic Law is explained at this website:

http://www.partnersintorah.org/posts/parsha-partner/parsha-archive-version1/page/6/

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by bwellmysoul

Catechism of the Catholic Church:

http://www.vatican.va/archive/ccc_css/archive/catechism/p3s2c1a1.htm#2084

the Ten Commandments
first, 2084-141
second, 2142-67
third, 2168-95
fourth, 2197-257
fifth, 2258-330
sixth, 2331-400
seventh, 2401-63
eighth, 2464-513
ninth, 2514-33
tenth, 2534-57

Evangelist, in your denomination, do you have counsel concerning the determination of God's will for us in this generation concerning faith and morals?

Some sort of Catechism?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by evangelist

quote:

---

Originally posted by bwellmysoul

Catechism of the Catholic Church:

http://www.vatican.va/archive/ccc_css/archive/catechism/p3s2c1a1.htm#2084

the Ten Commandments
first, 2084-141
second, 2142-67
third, 2168-95
fourth, 2197-257
fifth, 2258-330
sixth, 2331-400
seventh, 2401-63
eighth, 2464-513
ninth, 2514-33
tenth, 2534-57

Evangelist, in your denomination, do you have counsel concerning the determination of God's will for us in this generation concerning faith and morals?

Some sort of Catechism?

---

I think this would be the neareth thing we have is this verse and many like it, because I am a bible final authority belever:

Jas:2:10: For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.

one love

---

quote:

---

Sin of Partiality.* 1

My brothers, show no partiality as you adhere to the faith in our glorious Lord Jesus Christ. 2

For if a man with gold rings on his fingers and in fine clothes comes into your assembly, and a poor person in shabby clothes also comes in, 3and you pay attention to the one wearing the fine clothes and say, “Sit here, please,” while you say to the poor one, “Stand there,” or “Sit at my feet,” 4have you not made distinctions among yourselves and become judges with evil designs?*

5Listen, my beloved brothers.

Did not God choose those who are poor* in the world to be rich in faith and heirs of the kingdom that he promised to those who love him?a 6

But you dishonored the poor person.

Are not the rich oppressing you?

And do they themselves not haul you off to court? 7

Is it not they who blaspheme the noble name that was invoked over you?b 8

However, if you fulfill the royal* law according to the scripture, “You shall love your neighbor as yourself,” you are doing well.c 9

But if you show partiality, you commit sin, and are convicted by the law as transgressors.d 10

For whoever keeps the whole law, but falls short in one particular, has become guilty in respect to all of it.e 11

For he who said, “You shall not commit adultery,” also said, “You shall not kill.”f Even if you do not commit adultery but kill, you have become a transgressor of the law. 12g

So speak and so act as people who will be judged by the law of freedom.* 13

For the judgment is merciless to one who has not shown mercy; mercy triumphs over judgment.h

---

quote:

---

* [2:12–13] The law upon which the last judgment will be based is the law of freedom. As Jesus taught, mercy (which participates in God’s own loving mercy) includes forgiveness of those who wrong us (see Mt 6:12, 14–15).

* [2:14–26] The theme of these verses is the relationship of faith and works (deeds).

It has been argued that the teaching here contradicts that of Paul (see especially Rom 4:5–6).

The problem can only be understood if the different viewpoints of the two authors are seen.

Paul argues against those who claim to participate in God’s salvation because of their good deeds as well as because they have committed themselves to trust in God through Jesus Christ (Paul’s concept of faith).

Paul certainly understands, however, the implications of true faith for a life of love and generosity (see Gal 5:6, 13–15).

The author of James is well aware that proper conduct can only come about with an authentic commitment to God in faith (Jas 2:18, 26).

Many think he was seeking to correct a misunderstanding of Paul’s view.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by bwellmysoul


http://www.usccb.org/bible/jas/2:12#67002012-1

The 'law of freedom' (13) explains:

quote:

---

* [2:12–13] The law upon which the last judgment will be based is the law of freedom. As Jesus taught, mercy (which participates in God’s own loving mercy) includes forgiveness of those who wrong us (see Mt 6:12, 14–15).

* [2:14–26] The theme of these verses is the relationship of faith and works (deeds).

It has been argued that the teaching here contradicts that of Paul (see especially Rom 4:5–6).

The problem can only be understood if the different viewpoints of the two authors are seen.

Paul argues against those who claim to participate in God’s salvation because of their good deeds as well as because they have committed themselves to trust in God through Jesus Christ (Paul’s concept of faith).

Paul certainly understands, however, the implications of true faith for a life of love and generosity (see Gal 5:6, 13–15).

The author of James is well aware that proper conduct can only come about with an authentic commitment to God in faith (Jas 2:18, 26).

Many think he was seeking to correct a misunderstanding of Paul’s view.

---

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by evangelist

---

quote:

---

Sin of Partiality.* 1

My brothers, show no partiality as you adhere to the faith in our glorious Lord Jesus Christ. 2

For if a man with gold rings on his fingers and in fine clothes comes into your assembly, and a poor person in shabby clothes also comes in, 3and you pay attention to the one wearing the fine clothes and say, “Sit here, please,” while you say to the poor one, “Stand there,” or “Sit at my feet,” 4have you not made distinctions among yourselves and become judges with evil designs?*

5Listen, my beloved brothers.

Did not God choose those who are poor* in the world to be rich in faith and heirs of the kingdom that he promised to those who love him?a 6

But you dishonored the poor person.

Are not the rich oppressing you?

And do they themselves not haul you off to court? 7

Is it not they who blaspheme the noble name that was invoked over you?b 8

However, if you fulfill the royal* law according to the scripture, “You shall love your neighbor as yourself,” you are doing well.c 9

But if you show partiality, you commit sin, and are convicted by the law as transgressors.d 10

For whoever keeps the whole law, but falls short in one particular, has become guilty in respect to all of it.e 11

For he who said, “You shall not commit adultery,” also said, “You shall not kill.”f Even if you do not commit adultery but kill, you have become a transgressor of the law. 12g

---

quote:

---

Where in James, does he then say to throw out the Commandments? You must me reading that from somewhere. I'm not able to see that in the writings.

---

quote:

---

You've asked me that twice, after I gave my full explanation. You need to toggle back up and read what I wrote.You've missed my reply.

---

quote:

---

No, that's not at all what James is writing to the Church. Please, reread the Scripture

---

quote:

---

Perhaps what you miss is Christ's Church in the reading.

One of the main purposes of the letters in Scripture was for liturgical use during Mass, for the catechizing of converts, etc.

quote:

---

All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness, so that the man of God may be thoroughly equipped for every good work.

---

Christ had already delegated to the Apostles His ability to forgive sins.

He and His Father had already sent the Holy Spirit into the Church.

---

quote:

---

What you may also be missing, is the Eucharist and how it was front and center to all Christian worship.

"They gathered together for prayers and for the Breaking of the Bread."

Scripture states that each person was to discern the Body, prior to receiving the Eucharist.

Acknowledgement of sin and reconciliation of sin was already established in the Early Church.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by bwellmysoul

quote:

---

Originally posted by evangelist

---

Putting James in proper contexts make James 2:10 harmonized perfectly with the rest of the bible so what the beef??

quote:

---

Sin of Partiality.* 1

My brothers, show no partiality as you adhere to the faith in our glorious Lord Jesus Christ. 2

For if a man with gold rings on his fingers and in fine clothes comes into your assembly, and a poor person in shabby clothes also comes in, 3and you pay attention to the one wearing the fine clothes and say, “Sit here, please,” while you say to the poor one, “Stand there,” or “Sit at my feet,” 4have you not made distinctions among yourselves and become judges with evil designs?*

5Listen, my beloved brothers.

Did not God choose those who are poor* in the world to be rich in faith and heirs of the kingdom that he promised to those who love him?a 6

But you dishonored the poor person.

Are not the rich oppressing you?

And do they themselves not haul you off to court? 7

Is it not they who blaspheme the noble name that was invoked over you?b 8

However, if you fulfill the royal* law according to the scripture, “You shall love your neighbor as yourself,” you are doing well.c 9

But if you show partiality, you commit sin, and are convicted by the law as transgressors.d 10

For whoever keeps the whole law, but falls short in one particular, has become guilty in respect to all of it.e 11

For he who said, “You shall not commit adultery,” also said, “You shall not kill.”f Even if you do not commit adultery but kill, you have become a transgressor of the law. 12g

---

quote:

---

Where in James, does he then say to throw out the Commandments? You must me reading that from somewhere. I'm not able to see that in the writings.

---

Do you keep every single law and commandments perfectly and never break none of them bwellmysoul???

quote:

---

You've asked me that twice, after I gave my full explanation. You need to toggle back up and read what I wrote.You've missed my reply.

---

Basically James is saying the same thing to you so are you perfect and don't effend or make any mistake in any points in your life bwellmysoul???

quote:

---

No, that's not at all what James is writing to the Church. Please, reread the Scripture

---

.

quote:

---

Perhaps what you miss is Christ's Church in the reading.

One of the main purposes of the letters in Scripture was for liturgical use during Mass, for the catechizing of converts, etc.

quote:

---

All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness, so that the man of God may be thoroughly equipped for every good work.

---

Christ had already delegated to the Apostles His ability to forgive sins.

He and His Father had already sent the Holy Spirit into the Church.

---

Please don't lie when giving your answer so don't fear to tell the truth, or you might have to go to a catholic priest to repent or do confession to him so he can forgive your sins by his blood!

quote:

---

What you may also be missing, is the Eucharist and how it was front and center to all Christian worship.

"They gathered together for prayers and for the Breaking of the Bread."

Scripture states that each person was to discern the Body, prior to receiving the Eucharist.

Acknowledgement of sin and reconciliation of sin was already established in the Early Church.

---

one love

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Faith_at_Large

Evangelist, Bewellmysoul is being honest and is just approaching things a little differently.

And one thing that is very important that you don't seem to agree with is that being guilty of all is not the same as meriting the same penalty.

If we are trying to earn our way in apart from Christ, there is no way to do this. But we are not.

Catholics are not trying to earn our salvation through works of any kind.

John made it very plain that while all sin is sin and none of it good, there is sin that kills and sin that does not kill. So stop trying to force a contradiction. Just because we sinned does not automatically mean spiritual death for born again Christians.

But, what John is saying is that there are sins that will result in spiritual death for born again Christians. John is not contradicting James as you so often seem to suggest.

And it is not just one sin. The sin spoken of is a category of sins, not a single sin, or else there would be only one sin that would not damn us to hell and that would be a pickle and a contradiction.

we reject Jesus by choosing to sin after we were freed from sin.

The good news is that Jesus is patient and we have many opportunities to become and remain reconciled to Him. But what we may not do is return to what we were freed from.

The original sin of Adam was not rejecting God in words but in deed. Adam ate the forbidden fruit after God said NO. That was the sin.

So while rejecting God is always a bad thing to do, it is not THE sin that we were freed from. Disobedience is the sin of Adam. This is THE SIN that we may not do.

Disobeying God in any of commandments is a sin. Now where as there is no such thing as a good sin, John assures us that there are different levels of sin - some we can't even pray for (mortal sin), and others so minor that we can ask God to forgive in someone else (venial sin or sin not unto death).

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by evangelist

What you are missing in your whole concept is comparing God ways against mans way of thinking and judgements on situations and things!

No, Jesus didn't teach that and neither did the Apostles.

again you must learn to know man has certain levels and base alot of thing we do by a curve God doesn't!

No, Jesus clearly taught about the harmful effects of sin.

There is no luke warm by God or some themostate temperture adjustment meter by God!

God knows "lukewarmness" in Christians and He said He would "spit them out".

That is why the bible say in Heb:11:1: Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.

http://www.scborromeo.org/ccc/p1s1c3a1.htm

God is Spirit, Jesus left earth and Ascended to His Father and they sent the Holy Spirit. We, 2,000 years from those events, develop faith through our intelligence and our will. Also why Jesus told Thomas "blessed are those who don't see, but believe."

Most christian when studying the bible miss so many revelation out one little texts which throw alot of truth out the door!

And many who read Sacred Scripture misinterpret the Words, that is why Christ instituted His Church, to properly teach and preach the Gospel.

Notice in that verse it didn't go by man standard and say the might be seen or one day become an evidence or become manifested one day in a thing!

NO! it is showing the thing is already there inb the spiritual realm, and before God complete evidence!

The Trinity, His angels and His saints exist outside our space / time yet are clearly able to influence our world.

But that is why there are so many churchy religious people being like a doubting thomas and wonder why the power of God is not working in thier lives!

"churchy religious people". You don't attend a worship service for the Lord?

To many christians and churchy are looking into the carnal fleshly realm or external sense of what they see, taste ,feel, smell, and hear, which alot of satan can work with knowing we are stuck on this philosophy, and not be spiritual like Romans is saying we should!

Jesus was flesh. He became flesh to instruct us "on the way to go"

Psalm 32:8 The LORD says, "I will guide you along the best pathway for your life. I will advise you and watch over you.



Before God you will get the same penalty, and a matter of fact there will be not be some in a hotter hell then other who did a very moral bad sins like Hitler going to a special hell.

Hell is hell.

Christ said that in His Father's house there are many rooms.


So James is correct if you miss one point even driven 56 in a 55mph zone you are guilty before God as commiting adultery, or muder, or child abuse in every way and etc!

James didn't write that. In the context of what he wrote - he is telling Christians that the Christian Church is a fulfillment of the justice that existed in the Old Testament for the poor.

James is saying it is a mortal sin for Christians who judge worthiness of persons by a person's wealth.

The poor are noble in God's eyes and are of the same equality as the rich. Both are adopted sons and daughters of God and both are equal is His eyes.

In the Christian Church, wealth is not status. Ministers are to treat the poor with the same equality that they treat the rich. All peoples coming to Christ's Church are to be treated as equals.

To have thoughts, words or deeds that run contrary to equal treatment and respect of all people (using wealth or the appearance of it as a yardstick) James is saying is a grave sin.

Evangelist, I've given you links to the Catechism of the Catholic Church's website. The Catechism defines venial and mortal sin and describes point by point the Ten Commandments.

quote:

---

Sin of Partiality.* 1

My brothers, show no partiality as you adhere to the faith in our glorious Lord Jesus Christ. 2

For if a man with gold rings on his fingers and in fine clothes comes into your assembly, and a poor person in shabby clothes also comes in, 3and you pay attention to the one wearing the fine clothes and say, “Sit here, please,” while you say to the poor one, “Stand there,” or “Sit at my feet,” 4have you not made distinctions among yourselves and become judges with evil designs?*

5Listen, my beloved brothers.

Did not God choose those who are poor* in the world to be rich in faith and heirs of the kingdom that he promised to those who love him?a 6

But you dishonored the poor person.

Are not the rich oppressing you?

And do they themselves not haul you off to court? 7

Is it not they who blaspheme the noble name that was invoked over you?b 8

However, if you fulfill the royal* law according to the scripture, “You shall love your neighbor as yourself,” you are doing well.c 9

But if you show partiality, you commit sin, and are convicted by the law as transgressors.d 10

For whoever keeps the whole law, but falls short in one particular, has become guilty in respect to all of it.e 11

For he who said, “You shall not commit adultery,” also said, “You shall not kill.”f Even if you do not commit adultery but kill, you have become a transgressor of the law. 12g

So speak and so act as people who will be judged by the law of freedom.* 13

For the judgment is merciless to one who has not shown mercy; mercy triumphs over judgment.h

---

before men it a differnt ball game FAITH!

We do having a loving mercyful God, but He still is a just God, and sins must be paid for some way because of His just and intergrity, and that is where the good news where God found a way out and that is alone through Jesus and the only way, and Him alone!

In the Sacrament of Reconciliation, through His Church, Jesus the Mediator, accepts our sins, forgives the repentant, absolves us from the punishment of disobedience (which we should receive) and instills His Grace into our souls.

The Sacrament of Reconciliation strengthens our will toward God.


one love

---

quote:

---

Or do you suppose that the scripture speaks without meaning when it says, “The spirit that he has made to dwell in us tends toward jealousy”?* 6But he bestows a greater grace; therefore, it says:c

“God resists the proud, but gives grace to the humble.”*

7So submit yourselves to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you.d 8

Draw near to God, and he will draw near to you. Cleanse your hands, you sinners, and purify your hearts, you of two minds.e 9

Begin to lament, to mourn, to weep.

Let your laughter be turned into mourning and your joy into dejection. 10

Humble yourselves before the Lord and he will exalt you.f

11Do not speak evil of one another, brothers. Whoever speaks evil of a brother or judges his brother speaks evil of the law and judges the law.*

If you judge the law, you are not a doer of the law but a judge.

12There is one lawgiver and judge who is able to save or to destroy.

Who then are you to judge your neighbor?g

---